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The Resting Place
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The Resting Place
When Jesus Stops
In this episode of The Resting Place podcast, we explore how our relationship with Jesus transforms us when we allow Him to meet us in our present reality rather than where we think we should be. True holiness increases joy rather than restricting it creating a powerful way for us to engage in the world around us.
Through a beautiful exploration of Jesus's encounter with the woman who touched His garment, this episode reveals Christ's extraordinary ability to be present with people in their darkness. While on an urgent mission to heal Jairus's daughter, Jesus still stopped for this "unimportant" woman, answering her unspoken question: "Do you see me and do you care?"
Whether you're feeling distant from God, trapped in religious performance, or hungry for a more authentic faith, this episode offers a fresh vision of Jesus that might just change everything. Listen now and rediscover the God who is far more relational than we've made Him.
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Hi everyone. I'm Ben and I'm Logan and we're the Robins. Welcome to the Resting Place Podcast. Further into this journey, my dreams shrink. It's an interesting thing your dreams get smaller but they're more important all at the same time.
Speaker 1:Um, I have a far greater desire to be a good dad than I do a good leader, and I have a far greater desire to be a good husband than I do. A leader of a mass movement. I don't care about that, I do not, god, I don't care, I don't care. And something that we're finding um, get this thing so I can. I'm just trying to get this microphone so I can get it out of my face but also have it so that it can be heard. I'm finding that we, as a movement so I'm kind of speaking to the movement, the greater movement at large, abroad, abroad, um, we use familial language and we use language of relationship, but there's still too much of a corporate mentality brought into that sort of language, if that makes sense, so it almost just becomes dead language. Um, and we have and I'm not calling anybody out specifically, but there's God, there's enough that I could do do that, and I don't need to do that. I'm nobody to do that. So I'm not trying to do that, but there's enough. There's enough there where we have, we've been so discipled to be a part of a corporate um expression that it's a business, it's a business model, it's a corporate model, it's a transactional model. And what happens then is, if the model is transactional, what will happen is that will bleed over into our relationship with the Lord and we'll be completely unable to relate to Him in the way that he wants to relate to us. And so what we have is we have an entire generation of Christians that have a transactional relationship with their Lord, and what that will breed if we're not careful so if we're not careful, what will happen is that will breed an inverse of the kind of of the kind that'll breed an inverse of the kind of heart that we're trying to build.
Speaker 1:So I listened to Bill Johnson's message this week. I don't know why I did this to myself. I was texting my cousin. I don't know why I did this to myself, but I listened to the message that he taught after Benny died and it was unreal. The things that man stood up there and said right after his wife had died. He said the backslider in heart will always judge god for the things he did not do. That's how he started his message. His wife has just passed from cancer.
Speaker 1:This is a man who I don't know if there's another soul in america that has seen more people healed of cancer. I would doubt it. I honestly would doubt it. The amount of healing conferences he's been to. I mean, he talks about a whole season of his traveling ministry where he did an experiment. He said I did an experiment For six months. I did an experiment and I would start my messages by saying it's normal for tumors to dissolve in the presence of Jesus and then would, at the end of his message, ask people to check themselves and there would be people all across the auditorium that would have had tumors dissolve off of their body because he said that. And then the next time he'd teach he wouldn't say that and then he'd ask people and there wouldn't be any.
Speaker 1:I'm saying that to say the man has seen some things. I watched him. I watched him, at voice of the apostles, pray for a girl who couldn't digest food. It happened right in front of me. She couldn't digest. She had a severe eating disorder and couldn't digest food because she'd so starved herself. Her body wasn't able to process food. And I watched him and I didn't know that's what was going on when I watched him pray for her. But we found out later through the testimony grapevine that that's what was going on with that girl and she was completely healed. And so he's standing there the weekend after his wife has died they've just put her in the ground and I've heard randy clark talk about going and being a part of that funeral and watching him and his kids sing over the grave of their his wife and their mother.
Speaker 1:And he starts it with the backslider and heart will always judge God for the things he did not do. And then goes on to lay out probably the greatest message I've ever heard on. Paul says I'm a slave for Christ, right, so how do you marry being a slave for Christ with being the righteousness of God in Christ? How do you marry those two things? They're both true. You don't get to make one true and the other not. Those things are both true. We owe him. He doesn't owe us. We owe him.
Speaker 1:And one of the things that happened with the faith movement was the faith movement began to, instead of allowing the message of righteousness to cause a humility of heart to come that would cause us to walk as those who are indebted to Jesus all our days. We began to walk with a strut that would say you owe me this because I'm the righteousness of God in Christ, and that change of heart will never produce the desired results If we do not allow the message of righteousness to cause a humility of heart to come. That would say I'm not entitled to anything, although we're heirs of everything. There's such a difference there I'm not entitled to anything, but I'm an heir to everything. That subtle difference will cause such a shift to come to the interior world of the believer that it will make everything that the Bible says is accessible accessible to that one. Everything that's accessible to that one will be accessible to that one.
Speaker 1:If we go the other way and allow the message of righteousness to cause us to become entitled, what will happen is we'll have a lot of really great head knowledge and we'll have a lot of really great ideas about who we are, and we'll have a lot of really good information. But that information will never become incarnational, ever. It will never do it. I don't know, and I know a lot of folks that still traffic in the faith movement and that, um. So I know a lot of folks that are still trafficking in that specific stream. And for the ones that have allowed the message of righteousness because really have allowed the message of righteousness, because really we owe the message of righteousness to the faith movement EW, kenyon, Dad Hagen, that whole crowd really pioneered the message of righteousness inside of the revival movement.
Speaker 1:But those that have allowed that to become an incarnational thing in their life, where they would say I owe Jesus while at the same time I'm an heir to everything, we have to be able to hold tension. I don't know why I'm talking about this. I did not intend to talk about this. We have to be able to hold the tension of I'm an heir to everything and everything is at my fingertips, while at the same time he doesn't owe me anything and I owe him everything. There's such a beautiful tension that that causes the believer to come into such maturity that when trials come and when hardship comes, that when trials come and when hardship comes, we're no longer shaken by the fact that there's trial and hardship and contradiction present. We're shaken by contradiction more often than not because we have a misunderstanding of what being an heir to. Everything looks like what being an heir to everything looks like. So contradiction comes and I'm staring it in the face and it's either allowed to shake me or it's not. It's either allowed to shake me or it's not.
Speaker 1:There's a steadiness that comes to the heart that would say I'm in this for my relationship with you and I'm after you. I'm after you, I'm not after the benefits that you provide me. These benefits are amazing and these benefits that I am heir to are everything. They're everything. They must be manifest in the earth for the earth to know that it's been reconciled back to God. They have to be. But that's not why I'm in this. I'm not in this for the things. I'm not in this for the miracle working power, although I love miracle working power.
Speaker 1:I love seeing people touched by the presence of Jesus. I love it. I love being touched by the presence of Jesus. I love all of the things that come with it, but I am not in it for those things.
Speaker 1:I'm in it for the relational journey of getting to know the one who lives in a cloud that the old saints used to call unknowing. He lives in the cloud of unknowing. You can't know him. He's beyond finding out, he's beyond knowing, but he's inviting us in, saying, hey, come in and know me, come in and know me. And we've got it so wrong. He's closer to the ghost of Christmas present than he is.
Speaker 1:Austere and mean. Y'all ever watch? Y'all ever watch Muppet Christmas Carol. I'm the only one in here, probably who's ever watched that movie. I watch it almost every year and you've got this giant. It's the ghost of Christmas present. He's this giant, jovial dude with long curly hair. He's a Muppet, so he looks weird. I'm not saying God is a ghost, so that's not what I'm saying, but he's closer to the personality type of the ghost of Christmas present than he is.
Speaker 1:The austere, removed, distant God that we were taught that he is. Come in and know me better man, that's what he says to Scrooge. Scrooge wakes up. He hears somebody laughing and eating like an enormous amount of food and he walks through this doorway to find this blinding light, a huge feast put before him and this man saying come in and know me better, god. If we took that kind of an idea into our relationship with our Abba, it would make the relational journey so much easier than we've made it.
Speaker 1:He's joyful, he's welcoming, he's joyful and he's welcoming. And, yeah, he's holy, but holiness is joy. If I could teach somebody that holiness would increase your joy, you'd have a lot more fun being holy. Holiness is designed to increase your joy, not take away from it. It doesn't mean quit putting on makeup and look like a hag all your days. Stop that. That's ridiculous. Holiness is more the joy of the Lord being made manifest in your life than you would ever understand, because holiness isn't what we've been taught that holiness is. Holiness is being set apart and in a culture of anxiety and depression, what could be more set apart than joyful ones? What could be more set apart than those who are consumed with a holy joy that causes the atmosphere in a room to go from dead and depressed and dry when they walk in, all of a sudden, oh boy, I felt something shift and now I'm starting to laugh. I felt something shift and all of a sudden I'm starting to feel this weight and this heaviness come off of me. I felt something shift when that person over there walked in the room and all of a sudden, the cloud is lifting. Guys, that would do so much more to win the culture. That would do much more to win the culture. That would do antidepressants. I heard a study and I don't know if it's right Cause it's just the only one I heard and usually when you're doing scientific stuff you need to do peer reviewed studies and that means you got to look at a bunch of stuff and I didn't do that. I heard one, but I'm teaching, so that's right.
Speaker 1:Over 50% of doctor visits that you go on, people are being prescribed some sort of antidepressant and I believe the number that I heard was 67%, if I'm remembering correctly. 67% of people that go to the doctor get prescribed some form of antidepressant. Guys, I'm not saying don't take antidepressants if you need them, if you've got a real need for them. Don't feel any condemnation, not from me. I take Tylenol. I can't say anything to you.
Speaker 1:My head starts to hurt and I reach for the Tylenol. I don't even wait. I have a passion for healing. I do. I love to see healing come to people. But when my head starts to hurt, you know what I do I drink a. I drink a glass of water and if it don't go away in 30 seconds, I'm reaching for a couple Tylenol because I don't want my head to hurt and it's.
Speaker 1:I'm not making light of the need for antidepressants. What I'm saying is I'm not going to condemn you for doing something. Take them. Take them, but realize that Jesus has come to bring wholeness to the areas that would need balancing. Um, holiness is joy. The Lord is more like the ghost of Christmas present than he is what we were taught in Sunday school. And if you haven't watched that, go watch that one clip. I'll pull it up on YouTube for you. Go watch that one clip. It's one of the best things in all the world. I watch it every Christmas and it still makes me laugh. It makes me laugh every single time.
Speaker 1:Scrooge is this mean old man. And this, this joy filled fat dude eating too much food and long curly hair, says come in and know me better. Well, I think I will. I think I will come in and know you better. Our Abba's more like that. He sits on a throne. It says that's surrounded by rainbows of many colors. That sounds a lot like fun to me. That sounds a lot like joy to me. That sounds a lot like that. Sounds a lot like he's more approachable than we ever imagined he was. And the four living creatures and all of that. That's awesome. That's a little bit terrifying to some folks. That's awesome. That sounds like fun to me too. It sounds like he had fun. It sounds like he had a bunch of fun creating things that wanted to worship him.
Speaker 1:And then, when he got done with all of that, he said I want somebody that wants to approach me because they want to, and I'm going to invite them in to a relational journey with me and through this relational journey we're going to get to know one another. He knows all the secrets of our hearts, but he still wants to know us. It's such an interesting. It's such an interesting way that he deals with human I'm trying to get to these notes it's such an interesting way that he deals with my heart. I'll use me as the example. I'll put myself up as the example. He knows all my ways, he knows all my hidden ways, he knows all the things in my subconscious and he knows all the things that are trouble areas for me. And he still wants to know me. He says I want to know you and I don't want to just know about you, I want to experientially know you. There's a difference in experientially knowing someone and actually having just simply head knowledge of these people, and our God is not content with simply having a knowledge of someone from a distance. He wants to get up close and very personal with us. Not as we should be as we are, as Brennan Manning is so fond of writing. Not as we should be as we are, jesus, and that's the perfect segue right there. I'm so good at this. That's a perfect segue.
Speaker 1:Jesus had this incredible ability. This incredible ability. You read the gospels, just live in the gospels. I just just read live in the gospels, live, live there. Read other things, but live in the gospels. Read other things, yes, read. Other things are great. All of them are beneficial and powerful and necessary, but live in the Jesus has this ability to meet people exactly where they're at, exactly where they're at, and his first move isn't to change anything. You can watch it. You can watch it all throughout Scripture. Watch it all throughout Scripture.
Speaker 1:A lot of times, blind people would come to him and he'd say what would you have me do for you? And I'm reading it. Two blind men follow Jesus from Pharisee's house, screaming the entire way Son of David, have mercy on us. Two blind men follow him. How blind men can follow someone? I have not yet figured out. I've not yet. Maybe it's like maybe they had like bat powers and like their ears were like a radar for them. I don't know, um, but two blind men follow Jesus crying out son of David, have mercy on me. Son of David, have mercy on me. Son of David, have mercy on me. Son of David, have mercy on me. Son of David, have mercy. And tell everybody's good and sick of hearing it.
Speaker 1:Then they do something a little bit out of the ordinary. Jesus goes into someone's home and they cross the threshold of this home. This would have been a breach of social etiquette. But I guess they're blind so they get a pass. I don't know, but they're not invited in. The two guys screaming are not invited in and Jesus walks in.
Speaker 1:These two blind men walk in and Jesus looks these dudes up and down and says what would you have me do for you? What do you mean? What would you have me do for you? You know darn well what I want you to do. You know that these two things right here that are supposed to have optical nerves and supposed to send transmissions to the rest of my body letting me know where things are that I could trip over. So I don't trip over them, these things where I can see things. I'd like to have them healed. I'd like to have them healed. He said okay, your faith has made you whole. Heals their eyes. They go on. Don't tell anybody about it. Why didn't Jesus just immediately do that for them?
Speaker 1:And you can see other examples too. Even with the woman caught in the act of adultery, even with her, where are your accusers? Where are your accusers? Where are your accusers? He didn't forgive her. He didn't say it's okay, I forgive you. You don't have to. No, no, no, no. He's sitting with her in the moment. He's sitting with her where she's at. He's sitting with her where she's at, where she's at. He's sitting with her where she's at. He's coming into her darkness. He's coming into the blind man's darkness he's coming into.
Speaker 1:There's so many examples and I'm trying to get to what I wrote down. I promise I'm going to get there and I'm not going to take forever greed either. There's so many examples of Jesus. He had this way and this is it's the most. It's one of the more beautiful things about Jesus in the scripture and there are many beautiful things about Jesus in the scripture.
Speaker 1:But he has this way that he comes into a really dark situation, something that's really nasty, something that the woman caught in the act. She's naked in front of a bunch of people who want to kill her. He writes a couple things in the sand, says something. They all walk off because they feel bad. Then he sits with her, doesn't move.
Speaker 1:Where are your accusers, lord? I don't see any. I don't see any accusers. I don't see anybody that was condemning me. Where'd they all go? Well, I don't condemn you either. But that moment, that moment between everyone walking, jesus saying let him, who is without sin, cast the first stone, everyone dropping their stones and leaving and then asking that woman where are your accusers? We don't get told how long that was. Could have been 30 seconds, it could have been an hour, we don't know. And I'm sure there's Jewish history that if I talk to a rabbi somewhere which eventually I'll do that I'm sure I could find out exactly how long that was, because they've got all kinds of history that's just unbelievable, all kinds of history that's just unbelievable.
Speaker 1:He sat there with her present, with her in her darkness, and I contend that it was the sitting with her in her darkness that allowed him to say to her go and sin no more, that empowered her to actually go and sin no more. So he didn't meet her there. It's just another man. You gotta have to catch this. If he did not meet her there, it's just another Pharisee pointing a finger at her. It's just another Pharisee pointing a finger at her. That command go and sin no more can either be condemnation or empowerment. And the difference was he met her where she was.
Speaker 1:Jesus is far more relational than we've made him. Jesus is far more relational than we've made him. If we're going to recapture the real Jesus, if we're going to recapture the real gospel, we're going to have to be able first to let him meet us in our darkness, in the dark spaces, and not immediately get uncomfortable when he comes and not immediately get anxious and anxiety-ridden and having to. I got to go do something for Jesus. He's here. I got to go do something for Jesus. He's here. I better, as a good soldier of Christ, go do something for Jesus.
Speaker 1:We've been so discipled to be soldiers of Christ we don't have any ability to come off our mission, and so we're constantly doing things when he wants to sit with us, now, eventually that sitting with us is going to cause something to spin out of that. But that's not the initial cause for which he comes. He didn't initially. That's not the initial cause for which he comes. He comes to meet us where we're at, not where we should be, and in meeting us where we are at, it empowers us to move to the place that he's always designed us to be. But you're going to have to be willing to let him meet you where you're at, not where you want to be. That's such a difference. There's such a difference in the mindset that allows Jesus to come meet me where I'm at and not pretend I'm somewhere else.
Speaker 1:When I say he had this ability to be really present and this ability to meet people where they're at, I'm not talking about him coming and hanging out with people, although he did a lot of that. He ate more meals than he healed people. He ate more meals than he healed people. Baxter Kruger, I'll thank him forever for that. That's such a powerful revelation.
Speaker 1:Introspection, if done incorrectly, is really unhealthy. It's really unhealthy. I've watched people be introspective for years and it'd be the worst thing in the world for them Kill them, cause them to never make any progress. Introspection but there's a healthy introspection that would allow me to look inside the interior world and say there are some things that are here that are not congruent with what I'm told in scripture is my inheritance and that's where Jesus wants to come meet me. He doesn't need to come meet me over here. That's the. That's done. That's the finished work. Come meet me, he doesn't need to come meet me over here. That's done. That's the finished work. It's over. The process is finished, not the process.
Speaker 1:The continual transformation of the believer, the continual transformation of the believer is finished. I'm the image of Christ at that point. Right, that's what I've been predestined to become is the image of Christ. At that point, I'm the image of Christ. What does he need to meet me in that? For he will, out of goodness, because he wants to spend time with me, because he loves me? Yes, absolutely. But the transformative power of Jesus is met when we have the ability to, with healthy introspection, realize there are still some things that need to be ironed out in the interior places of my soul and in looking in the interior places of my soul, not dwelling there, not being depressed by that, not staying there and constantly mourning over the fact that maybe I'm not as far along as I would like to be in some areas, but rather saying Jesus, you can come meet me right here, jesus, you can come meet me right here. And Jesus, you can come meet me right here and be present with me in this place. And if you'll be present with me in this place, what that will then cause me to be as incarnational, that'll cause me to be the incarnational image of Christ in the culture. That's what will end up happening.
Speaker 1:Goodness, I've said more than I intended to about that. So I'm going to read something from the great dance and then we're going to go to Mark five and I'm going to be 20 more minutes. That's a lie. That is a lie. I lied to all of you just there, 63. And I read this in the podcast I released. But I want to read this again because I think that this bears repeating, and I'm going to read the paragraph above it. This microphone is the bane of my existence right now and it's my fault. It is my fault. I'm going to read the paragraph above it, on page 63, before I get to the piece that I'm really wanting to hammer down on.
Speaker 1:It is just too human for us to understand, too close, too real, too ordinary for us to see it. Jesus has been turned into such a spectator who watches us from a distance that we have no idea who we are and what is happening in our ordinary lives. Read that again. Jesus has been turned into such a spectator who watches us from a distance. Read that again. Is staring us in the face. Do we honestly believe that our love for our children, our delight in flowers and gardening, our creativity and insight, our concern for others and our tears have their origin in our own hearts, that they would have their origin in our own hearts, that they would have their origin in our own hearts? If Jesus is a spectator, we can't know Jesus. We can't. If Jesus is a far-off, removed spectator, we cannot know who we are and what is going on in our ordinary lives. He ate more meals than he healed people. He ate more meals than he healed people.
Speaker 1:One of the problems with cause-driven Christianity, which is primarily what we have in revival culture in the West, is cause-driven Christianity. It's all. We've got a cause, we've got a cause and we're going to fight for that cause. Okay, that's great, I love that. There are certain causes. We've got a cause and we're going to fight for that cause. Okay, that's great. I love that. There are certain causes I'm very passionate about.
Speaker 1:But if our Christianity is driven by causes, if our relationship with the Lord is driven by causes, what will happen is we'll miss the beauty of the incarnation of Jesus in our daily lives. And, guys, there's a lot more normal moments than there are stadiums filled with people and what the old saints used to have a really great revelation on this. The old saints used to have a really great revelation on this. You know, in Acts, you could, I heard, I heard my Bible teacher in Bible school teach me one time. He said you know, in Acts every chapter was about a year in length. Just about a year between chapters is what you could really is what you could really qualify and see.
Speaker 1:So, while Peter's having his shadow fall on the sick and they're being healed, that's amazing. It's incredible. Both thumbs I would give for that right now. I would. You can have my thumbs. If I can do that. If I can do that, you can have my thumbs. We'll trade. It's a good trade, it's a fair trade. Really, we'll do it.
Speaker 1:But that wasn't all Peter was doing. And sometimes we read it. Sometimes we read the story. We read the story You're like, oh my God, that's amazing, that's all he did. No, it's not Actually. No, it's not amazing, that's all he did. No, it's not Actually. No, it's not.
Speaker 1:Peter had a wife. He had kids. He traveled with his wife. Paul teaches us in 1 Corinthians Peter traveled with his wife. His itinerant ministry was with his wife. There's a lot of meals. There's a lot of interaction with his babies. There's a lot of interaction with other people. There's a lot of interaction with the Lord in between these big explosions that we see in Acts. And I want those, god, I want those. That is, I'm passionate about revival.
Speaker 1:We were in Kentucky when Pop went over to Kentucky and we went out to Buffalo Wild Wings because our apostle loves chicken wings and we're all eating chicken wings and they were giving me a hard time because we had to leave the next day and they called an extra service and I was so jealous that I didn't get to stay. I was upset. I was like God, I'd like to stay, I'd have to call off work and I'd have to do a couple other things. It just wasn't going to work. And Brad Custer, the pastor there in Kentucky, was like well, if you want revival, and pop and Brad kind of laughed and then pop was like I don't think there's a person in this, in this room or at this table that would question if Ben wants revival.
Speaker 1:It's just not, if you know me. There's just not a question. There isn't a question that that is the burning center of who I am. I want Jesus to be made manifest. But, guys, there's a life, man, there's a rich, beautiful life that is the incarnation of Jesus to the culture. That has nothing to do with a revival service, that has nothing to do with leading people and building a corporation. That's what most churches have become corporations that peddle something weaker than the actual power of the gospel. There's something better than that and it's a relational journey with Jesus that causes you to take mundane everyday moments and allow them to be the bread and body of Christ to you and that will cause transformation, first in here and then out there.
Speaker 1:As Pop says, the world within you is the answer for the world around you. The world within you is absolutely the answer for the world around you, and I used an example in our podcast about my date with Willow and I'm not going to do that again because I'm not going to allow that I don't share those things very frequently. That's something I do with fear and trembling because I don't want my I don't, that's okay. I don't want those moments to become sermon points. I will say this, though that's not out of the ordinary for my kids. And I will say this though that's not out of the ordinary for my kids and I, logan can tell you that's not out of the ordinary for me to share really normal moments with her, with the kids, and be overwhelmed by the glory of the Lord in those moments, moments he wants to meet us there.
Speaker 1:I'm telling you the difference in atmosphere when, when Willow and I left that McDonald's, as opposed to when we walked in. You've walked into a McDonald's before it is. There's some things going on in that place usually hatred, anger, usually hatred anger and I felt the whole of the atmosphere shift when she started to laugh. That's a lot bigger deal than we realize Laughing with your babies. There's an old man sitting in a booth not far from us that was completely alone, sitting there drinking a drink alone, and he might have had family, I don't know, but it looked kind of sad to me, looked kind of sad to me and I think we gave him the most beautiful illustrated sermon of the gospel.
Speaker 1:You want to give somebody an illustrated sermon of the gospel? Sit your baby on your knee, get locked in and laugh. God, guys, this is the power of the gospel Changing environments by releasing something as silly as that's really funny what you just said, and I'm going to laugh at the top of my lungs and not care. If everybody else in here wants to kill me, I don't care. And if we can become those sort of people I'm not saying, I'm not saying you know, you all know me well enough to know there are all kinds of warts that come along with me, all kinds of them. My wife knows, my kids know there are all kinds of things where I am a work in progress. But if we can become those kind of people, man, that carry the light of the gospel with us into atmospheres and all we got to do is laugh, guys, that is the image of Jesus to those people.
Speaker 1:What better image of Jesus to give to a lonely individual sitting in a McDonald's booth by themselves? That's the saddest thing I've ever heard. That's one of the saddest things I've ever heard. Elderly gentleman sitting alone in a McDonald's booth drinking a soda. Maybe he's very happy, I don't know. I kind of doubt it. But maybe if you catch me in my seventies or eighties alone in a McDonald's booth eating drinking a soda, I'm not okay, send help. I'm going to push the SOS thing on the on the medical alert bracelets and just say send help, I need some help. I couldn't have given that man a better illustration of the gospel, so much better than walking up to him and handing him a tract. Make a decision, yes or no. If you died tonight, would you go to hell or would you be with God in heaven? Oh man, I gave him such a better illustrated sermon. So I'm trying to read. And what have I done with that book? I don't know what I've done with it. There it is.
Speaker 1:Several years ago I stood on on the mound pitching baseball to a dozen little boys. Now she know anything about little boys. He doesn't give an age, but that's a challenge all by itself. Right, there are a dozen of them in one place. Good Lord, it's either join in and just become part of the chaos or it's going to bother you. Um, most of the boys did not know much about baseball. That makes it worse, that makes it more chaotic, but they were caught up in it. That means they were building sandcastles and they were chasing butterflies and picking grass and doing all the things, but they were caught up in it.
Speaker 1:I could see the eagerness in their eyes. I could see the eagerness in their eyes, the determination. I saw their camaraderie and fellowship and I loved being in the middle of it. But inside of me there was a little wrestling match going on. One part of me was thrilled and the other part of me felt guilty. At that time I was a pastor and I felt guilty that I was having so much fun doing something so secular that deals with the invisible or the I'd call it the fictional line between the secular and the holy right. The Orthodox Church calls it holy leisure Something so secular.
Speaker 1:I should be praying for people visiting the sick or working on my sermon, at least talking to these boys trying to get them saved. At the very least he could be doing that. I mean, after all, he is a pastor. After all, he has been entrusted with the shepherding of some people's souls. He could be shepherding people at this moment. Right, right in the middle of that wrestling match, the Lord spoke to me Baxter, don't you dare miss this. Don't you dare miss this. Don't you dare miss what is happening here on this field with these 12 boys. Baxter, there is more of my glory here, more of my life and the fellowship I share with the Father, more of the spirit of sonship and the free-flowing dance of the Trinity on this field than you have ever seen in those sterile church services. First of all, that'd make me feel bad if I was a pastor. Oh, baxter, do not be blind. The great dance is present, not absent, and over the next two gatherings we're going to explore two different stories of the dance being present in the Gospels. The first one we're going to look at is in Mark, chapter 5, and I'm going to be 10 more minutes. Maybe that's a lie. I'm lying again. The Lord's going to have to cleanse me of my lying tongue.
Speaker 1:Mark 5, verse 21. Verse 21 says after Jesus returned from across the lake, a huge crowd of people quickly gathered around him on the shoreline when he was before this, immediately before. This is the encounter with the demoniac from the Gadarenes. He has a name and he was made the apostolic head of ten cities after his encounter with Jesus, but we still call him the demoniac. Jesus heals this man and it so terrifies the countryside. They ask him to leave. So crazy, revival comes. This man gets healed. Who is chained in a graveyard, cutting himself with stones? Chains can't hold him. He breaks the chains. He cuts himself with stones. He terrorizes the countryside. Jesus heals this man and they ask him to leave. Shocking to me, first of all, shocking to me, that they would respond that way to the miracle working power of Jesus. This man was a menace to society. A menace to society and Jesus heals him.
Speaker 1:He's sitting in his right mind at the feet of Jesus and the city people come to him and say we don't want you to be here anymore. Wait, what? What? So Jesus releases this man. He says I want to come with you. Jesus says you don't have a need to come with me. All you have to do is go and tell people the great things God has done for you in the middle of your darkness. Go and tell them the way I met you. There's something about a testimony that carries more power than we realize that it carries, and there are people that will be profound. Bill Johnson wrote a book about it releasing the power of Jesus. The whole book is about releasing your testimony and the power of Jesus that it carries, and it's one of the best books I've ever read and it's incredible and profound. And the best I've come up with is there's something about your testimony that's pretty powerful. There's something about it that's pretty powerful. Jesus sends this man into the ten cities and says just go tell your story. So he comes back and that's where we find Jesus In the story. That's where he is.
Speaker 1:Just then a man saw that it was Jesus, so he pushed through the crowd and threw himself down at his feet. His name was Jairus, a Jewish official who was in charge of the synagogue. He pleaded with Jesus, saying over and over Please come with me. My little daughter is at the point of death and she's only twelve years old. Come and lay your hands on her and heal her, and she will live Immediately. Jesus went with him and the huge crowd followed Jesus, pressing in on him from all sides. So we find Jairus, who we could do a study on this man all by itself and we probably could spend a month there. But Jairus comes and humbles himself to the point that he realizes his whole life has been given to a religion that remains powerless.
Speaker 1:And there's something about this traveling rabbi who the folks in Judea seem to dislike and they seem to have a huge issue with him. But my daughter's going to die and the religion that I received from the folks in Judea does not seem to have the power to lift her off of her sickbed. But I've heard enough stories about this traveling rabbi that I think I'm going to go humble myself. So Jesus agrees to go with him and in the way that we have been discipled and most of it is well-intentioned. So when I say things like this, it's not I don't believe anyone that discipled me had ill intentions, but we've been trained to be good soldiers of Christ and Jesus has a mission. He needs to go accomplish this mission. He gets a mission from heaven Go heal this man's daughter. All right, let's go do it. And if I'm Jesus, I'm getting on my horse and we're going and I'm not stopping until I get there. We're going to go and heal this man's daughter.
Speaker 1:But Jesus had this ability to be present, and when I say present, it's a different thing than just looking me in the eye and being present in my conversation. He had an ability to, in the middle of going to accomplish the healing of Jairus' daughter. He had the ability to be completely present in the moment. The kingdom of God is present. That's how he could say the kingdom of God is at hand, because he was completely present in the moment. The kingdom of God's only at hand if you're present in the moment. If you're off somewhere else, if you're off somewhere else, the kingdom of God is not at hand for you because the kingdom of God invades your moments. I hope I'm expressing this the way that I feel it. I hope I'm expressing this the way that I feel it, because the kingdom of God is present in our moments. It's not off into the future. The kingdom of God is at hand for the one who's completely settled in their moment, completely at rest, completely whole, completely in the moment. And Jesus then comes and says the kingdom of God is at hand. Immediately, jesus went with him and the huge crowd followed, pressing in on him from all sides.
Speaker 1:Now in the crowd that day was a woman who had suffered horribly from continual bleeding for 12 years. She had endured a great deal under the care of various doctors, yet in spite of spending all she had on their treatment, she was still getting worse instead of better when she heard about Jesus' healing power, she pushed through the crowd and came up from behind him and touched his prayer shawl. For she kept saying to herself if I could touch even his clothes, I know I would be healed. I want to know how she knew that, because there is not a testimony in the gospel before she did this that she'd get healed that way. That was not a method someone had used before she did this. That was nothing that she had heard from someone else. As soon as her hand touched him, her bleeding immediately stopped. She knew it, for she could feel her body instantly being healed of her disease.
Speaker 1:Jesus knew at once that someone had touched him, for he felt the power that always surged around him had passed through him for someone to be healed. He turned and spoke to this is another of your parables. Jesus. His disciples answered what do you mean? Who touched you? Look at this huge crowd. They're all pressing up against you, but Jesus' eyes swept across the crowd looking for the one who had touched him for healing. They're all pressing up against you, but Jesus' eyes swept across the crowd looking for the one who had touched him for healing. When the woman who experienced this miracle realized what had happened to her. She came before him trembling with fear and threw herself down at his feet saying I was the one who touched you, and she told him her story of what had just happened. Then Jesus said to her Daughter, because you dared to believe, your faith has healed you. Daughter, because you have dared to believe, your faith has healed you, go with peace in your heart and be free from your suffering.
Speaker 1:I'm going to read a little bit of what I wrote last night while I was preparing. Jesus has this incredible ability to be absolutely present with everyone he interacts with. This had to be both a wonder to behold and absolutely excruciating for those who are closest to him. To him, over the next couple of decades or not decades, yeah, decades over the next couple of decades. I want to explore two interactions I think that was not a slip of the tongue Over the next couple of decades. I want to explore two interactions that illustrate for us so beautifully how Yeshua releases the kingdom, us so beautifully, how Yeshua releases the kingdom, how Yeshua releases the kingdom.
Speaker 1:They call her the woman with the issue of blood. They call her the woman with the issue of blood, but that's not what Yeshua calls her. The Orthodox Church calls her St Veronica. The Orthodox Church calls her St Veronica and Yeshua calls her daughter For the same amount of time. I didn't realize that for the same amount of time. Yep, that's the only woman he calls daughter in all of the Gospels. I didn't realize that, really. Nobody else. Wow, well, that's more permission for me to go even deeper on this. He's the only one. That's the only one Jesus calls daughter. That's the only womanesus calls daughter in the whole of the, in the whole of the gospels. Lucy said so, so it's true. For this, just in life in general, my mom's name is lucy too, so lucy said so, so it's true. For the same amount of time j iris daughter had been alive.
Speaker 1:This one had been suffering such an interesting in such an interesting story, the story of these two. Mosaic law forbid this woman from being active in her culture in any important way because of the nature of her suffering. For all practical purposes, her life had been over for the last 12 years. Her life had been over for the last 12 years. She could not go out in public and anyone who touched her was ceremonially unclean and had to go through ritual cleansing. Just for having been around this woman. She, for all intensive purposes, had the plague and no one could go near her. I don't think I can stress that enough. She took her life in her hands just by going out in public, in her hands, just by going out in public. And God forbid that her hemorrhaging got worse, because if it didn't, it showed up on her clothes. Everyone would know and everyone would have the right then to exact punishment on her. For all practical purposes, her life had been over for the last 12 years.
Speaker 1:So we see saint veronica, someone who had spent every penny they had trying to get their life back, only to be left in a condition that was that was considered somehow worse than it was before. Somehow it's worse. I don't know if it gets a lot worse, but scripture says that she was left in a worse condition than when the treatment started. It's already pretty bad and I spent all my money and it got worse. Already pretty bad and I spent all my money and it got worse.
Speaker 1:Her condition left her not much better than a leper and in some ways it would have been more isolating than the life of a leper. Like the leper, she was unable to participate in her culture in any significant way. But they didn't have colonies for people like her. She was to be completely isolated to live with just her shame to keep her company. They didn't have colonies for people like her. You can read Mosaic Law for women that get on their menstrual cycle and they're to be completely isolated from even their family. That's the way she would have been treated.
Speaker 1:And I've heard I've heard pop teach before. Come on up here, sissy. You can come on up. You're welcome. You teach better than I do. Um, I've heard pop teach before that this. There's heard Pop teach before that there are some theologians that believe that this was an STD that caused her to menstruate this way, that caused this sort of bleeding.
Speaker 1:It would have been possible that that was a side effect from living a promiscuous lifestyle, and it could be that wrong choices had led her to this place of complete and total isolation. So she would have been left with just her and her shame to keep her company. I don't know what's worse. I mean, her skin's not falling off, but she's still not able to be around anybody. My Bible has a heading above verse 21 that reads Two Miracles Healing and Resurrection. But it would be no great exaggeration to rename that heading Two Resurrections. That woman's life was over. It would never change, it would never get better. She would be alone the rest of her life.
Speaker 1:We don't know, we don't have a value for that kind of isolating, crippling fear and that kind of isolating, crippling rejection from culture like that woman would have had. Because we have the benefit of modern medicine, anybody that says it's better in the old days than it is today is a liar. That ain't true. That, just that simply ain't true. I like being able to go to the doctor and they give me something and my heart not explode. I kind of like that. I like the fact that my brother, although he did not receive the kind of healing I wanted, I'm glad they were able to give him a new heart. I'm really glad they were. That wouldn't have been available even 50 years ago. This woman we don't have a barometer for the way that she was isolated, alone and, for all intensive purposes, dead to the culture. St Veronica was as good as dead and she got her life back that day.
Speaker 1:I have heard many profound messages on both the Christ-centered desperation and faith of this woman and the awareness Christ had of the degree of presence and power that were in and on him. I can hear some of the most profound teachers and preachers saying many touched him that day, but one touched him with intention. And there are folks that can preach it. Man, goodness you get around TD Jakes or anybody of that stream that can just flat dog preach it. That'll make you chew through it. That'll make you chew through a tree, as my faith, my faith teacher, used to say. It makes me want to chew through a tree. It would do. You listen to somebody who can really preach, teach this message and they start to talk about the desperation inside of that woman that drove her to do something that no one had ever done before to get a hold of the presence of Jesus. I'll jump through a window. I'll jump through a window listening to that. I'll do it. Y'all don't know me, I'll do it. And I want to explore this interaction just briefly.
Speaker 1:Jairus comes, possibly with his entourage, and begs Yeshua to heal his daughter. Yeshua agrees. He's now been given a mission and if he's a good soldier for the cross, if he's a good soldier for the cross, if he's a good soldier for the kingdom of heaven, he's on a mission now and he's going to go accomplish this mission at all costs. And the means, and the end outweighs the means. The end would always outweigh the means. Right outweighs the means. The end would always outweigh the means, right? We're doing enough that the means of where we got there doesn't really matter. We're doing enough. The means of where we got there really doesn't matter. So my motives, my intentions, none of that has to actually be pure because I'm actually doing things for God. None of the interior world of my heart really needs to be dealt with because I'm actually doing things for God. None of the interior world of my heart really needs to be dealt with because I'm doing things for God. And that the end outweighs the means, right, guys? And so we're going to build something in the way that we build it. The end outweighs the means. So we can do just whatever the hell we want to to get that built, and that will always outweigh the means.
Speaker 1:And, friend, it does not work that way and that's why we're in the situation that we're in. That's why pastors are miserable by the scores, depressed and miserable, hate their lives, hate their wives and hate their kids. They want to be done. The statistics are staggering because we're good soldiers and we're on a mission and whatever means necessary is what we have to use to get that mission accomplished. And I want to say as loudly and as as loudly and inappropriately as I can the hell with that. The hell with that. That will not be how the that will not be how America is won back to Jesus. We've seen that story and we've seen the ending and it's always tragic. Even if the leader has good character and doesn't fall, that ministry is done as soon as he's done. It's done Even if he doesn't fall, has no issues, loves his wife, good husband, good man, good quality, strong Christian ministry is done as soon as he hands it over to somebody.
Speaker 1:Because we have no ability to build for longevity and that requires thinking beyond a brand. This brand I don't know why I'm talking about this this brand Christianity is so short-lived and short-sighted. We create a brand and we use a personality to be a brand. Guys, that has a shelf life of about 10 years. That has a shelf life of about 10 years and you better rebrand every couple years. So you have to become a chameleon and you're required to be a narcissist. It will not work and that's for free. That was just for free, you're welcome.
Speaker 1:He's on a mission to do what he was sent to do. While he's on his way, someone asks an audacious question without asking a question. While he's on his way, someone asks a question of him and it comes in the form of touching his cloak. Do you see me and do you care? And the answer for those individuals in our culture is no, we don't. We don't, you don't have anything to give me. You don't have anything to offer me. You don't have any way to advance what I'm trying to build. You don't have a way to be a cog in the wheel of this corporation. So, no, I don't see you and no, I don't care.
Speaker 1:Id Baker built a whole ministry stopping for people like this, they call it. They've, they've turned it into a cliche saying and I kind of hate the saying. But the premise is so powerful just because I hate things that become cliche that you that are so powerful, they call it stopping for the one. And that may not sound cliche to anybody else. Maybe it's just me, because I've heard it so much, cause I follow, I follow it and I I have such a value for it. Someone asked him a question and it's so. It's so interesting how you don't have to say it to ask the question Do you see me and do you care? And he had a choice in that moment. He's busy, he's a good soldier for the cross and he's got a mission to go heal someone important's daughter.
Speaker 1:You don't think that the leader of the synagogue in Capernaum I don't know how you pronounce it, I'm a redneck In Capernaum. I'll call it Capernaum. That's where we'll land on that for the most Sandiogans. We'll land on Capernaum for the moment. Sandiogans Anchorman San Diego and San Diego Anchorman, you're welcome. I got Jared to laugh. Oh my God, I got Jared to laugh. He's on his way to heal someone, someone who's important. He's on the way to touch someone's family member who could advance his ministry.
Speaker 1:That man led the whole of the synagogue in Capernaum. Get you a lot more views, get you a lot more influence. Build your brand, cause an advancement the way we like to say it. God's really got his hand on him for advancement at this point. That's true. There's truth in that.
Speaker 1:But he had this ability, when someone asked him these questions, to stop dead in his tracks and hang everything else going on around him and zero in and be so present and invade that darkness with the superior kingdom of light. Every time, every time, he's busy doing the work of the kingdom. He had a choice in that moment. He's busy doing the work of the kingdom, but here's the thing the great dance is present, kingdom, he had a choice in that moment. He's busy doing the work of the kingdom, but here's the thing the great dance is present. The great dance is always present. It's always present, and he was so anchored in the fellowship of the Father in spirit that it made Yeshua free enough to be present with him. There's an anchoring that has to take place in our lives if we're ever going to have the ability to leverage the kingdom into present moments with people. We have to be anchored in the fellowship of the Father, son and Spirit to bring their presence into our present moments.
Speaker 1:What would the harm be if he kept on moving? What would the harm be if he kept on moving? What would the harm be? He was so powerful. Her bleeding had stopped, and stopping or continuing on wouldn't change that. What's the harm? The miracle's done. She got what she needed. I can keep moving. The miracle's done. It's accomplished. She got the thing she asked for, but that wasn't the question she asked the miracle's done. She got the thing she was seeking. But that wasn't the question she was asking.
Speaker 1:Jesus could read between the lines and in between the lines he found the question do you see me and do you care? And we all find ourselves with this question Do you see me and do you care? Do you see me and do you care? And sometimes it's more like you don't see me and you don't care. Sometimes it's more like don't you see how long this has been going on and how sick I am of this going on and you haven't lifted a finger to help me? I don't think you do see me. Maybe I'm the only one who has those kinds of conversations with Jesus. I don't think I am. I think Lou's had a couple. At the very least Lou has. He's shaking his head. No, he's a saint Saint Lou over there.
Speaker 1:Sweet, he was so powerful her bleeding had stopped, and stopping or continuing wouldn't change that. But it would leave her perception of the father marred. He's distant, he's uncaring. He's distant and he's uncaring. And I'm not worthy for him to stop and engage with me and she this is important she would not receive the honor she was due for what she had done, she would not receive the honor she was due for what she had done. Her story doesn't get included in the love letter.
Speaker 1:If Jesus doesn't stop you ever. Stop and think about that. If he just keeps moving, continues on to Jairus house, kicks everybody out of the house because they're mourning, saying she's dead and you're an idiot for thinking she's still got life in her. She's dead, you can't do anything. You're a fanatic and we don't like you anyway. And all the other anything. You're a fanatic and we don't like you anyway. And all the other rabbis talk badly about you and I don't want you in my house. In fact, why don't you leave? Because that little girl's dead and we want to mourn and Jesus kicks them all out, heals Jairus' daughter.
Speaker 1:If he had just kept moving and moved into the next thing without being present in that moment, that woman would not have received the honor she was due for what she had done. That was important to Jesus' heart, the humility of Jesus in that moment, saying I could keep moving, but she would not then receive the honor she was due. If I kept moving, I'm going to make sure she's included in the story. If I kept moving, I'm going to make sure she's included in the story. I'm going to make sure that for generation after generation after generation, when someone is in need of a miracle, people will use the phrase reach out and touch the hem of his garment, the hymn of his garment. This woman, her story is repeated almost as often as Mary of Bethany pouring her oil out on Jesus. These are the two most prominent stories used, stories of women who were extravagant in their pursuit of Jesus. In all of scripture, mary and pouring her oil out, and the woman who dared to touch the hem of his garment. And it meant something to Jesus for her to be included in the narrative.
Speaker 1:Fast forwarding to verse 53 of mark, chapter 6, it says this they made landfall at guinness and anchored there. The moment they got out of the boat, everyone recognized that it was Jesus the healer. That wasn't uncommon, that was a common thing in scripture is they recognize that it's Jesus the healer who has come, and so a large crowd gathers. But something happened that was unlike any other time. Jesus had made landfall somewhere. So they ran throughout the region telling people Bring all the sick, even those too sick to walk, and bring them on mats. Wherever he went, in the countryside, villages or towns. They placed the sick on mats in the streets or in public places and begged him saying just let us touch the tassel of your prayer shawl and all who touched him were instantly healed. Wherever he went in the countryside, villages or towns they placed the sick on mats in the streets or in public places and begged him saying just walk past me and let me reach out and touch the hem of your garment and all who touched him were instantly healed.
Speaker 1:There was not a record in Scripture or that I'm aware of in Jewish history that before this woman did this extravagant act of faith in public, that anyone was healed by touching his garment and Jesus being present in a moment, stopping and answering her question. Do you see me and do you care Jesus? And do you care Jesus Allowed these others that would not have been able to be touched by Jesus to receive the thing that they needed from him because of what she did. You see that what she did gave others permission to do the same thing, and that would not have been the case had Jesus just kept moving. How many thousands more would have been left in prison and with questions had Jesus not stopped stopped One of the things that I find when I start to get into this pattern of thought is I find that there are still degrees of separation in my thinking that have to be dealt with.
Speaker 1:It's not nearly as big as it once was, it's not nearly what it used to be, but there are still degrees of the delusion of separation involved even in subconscious thought patterns, where you find yourself thinking something and I don't know why I'm thinking that, and I don't know why I'm thinking that and I don't know how that thought got there. That doesn't feel right to me. And all of a sudden you realize that your subconscious still needs to be reformed. And what we have done Somebody's having fun out there what we have done, what we have done, is we have mirrored back to the culture what we believe about our God. Whether we realize it or not, we mirror the things about Him that we believe. That's why it's really important to capture the real Jesus and the real gospel.
Speaker 1:And our and our inability to be present in these moments is a direct result of our belief of distance between us and the Father or distant separation still between us and our Abba. And if in our thinking we cannot resolve the distance, what will always mirror back will be separation. So we've got to be holy. So we're separate from the culture and we're removed from the culture and I thought that was the thing that we came to reform. I'm sorry, I'm uneducated, I'm not a theologian. I thought the most important parts of our culture that we're to reform we need to be in the middle of, rather than removed from. There had never been recorded healings done this way. But Saint Veronica touched is the important piece of this story. She touched him and he stopped. She touched him and he had a choice. Our Jesus is present with us in our darkness and our invitation is to follow him.